Speaker 0: Hello and welcome to our migration panel today at ParDreaming. My name is Christina Magoulas joining you from the Sercante team today and I will be your host for today’s panel. Pardot is one of the fastest growing products in the marketing automation ecosystem. Organizations across the globe and from every industry are using Pardot marketing automation to increase marketing ROI and campaign effectiveness. If you’re here today, you are probably considering a switch to Pardot from another marketing automation platform. Today, I have with me three panelists that have made the switch to Pardot. Terry Haines and Zach Chicha are both Pardot end users, having made the switch to Pardot from different marketing automation platforms. And Kelly Ryan, my colleague here at Sercante, has done migrations both as an end user in her previous client side of life and now as a consultant at Sercante. During today’s panel, we’ll be take talking a bit about marketing automation migration projects, considerations, and even some pitfalls so that when the time comes to do your own migration to Pardot, you are ready. We have a poll that we’re going to launch because we want to hear from you. What platform are you migrating from if you are in fact considering a migration to Pardot? I’d love to start by giving our panelists the chance to tell us a bit about themselves and their own migration journey. So I’m going to kick things over to Zach to begin our introductions. Zach, can you tell us a bit about yourself and your recent Pardot migration?

Speaker 1: Yes. Thank you. My name is Zach Chicha, uh, originally from Waterloo, Ontario, Canada. Early adopt Eloqua, became a subject matter expert, and, uh, I’m now in Silicon Valley. Always worked for industry leaders, uh, knew, uh, Eloqua extremely well in the other systems. We are now migrated over into Pardot and, um, here to answer any kind of questions that you may have.

Speaker 0: Thank you so much. Um, Terry, how about you? You want to tell us a little bit about your migration?

Speaker 2: Yeah. Thanks so much, Christina. Uh, my name is Terry Haines. I am the CRM Manager at CSIS. Uh, it’s a Washington DC based think tank, primarily kind of national security foreign policy think tank. Uh, but we switched from Mailchimp to Pardot back. We finished our migration in June. Uh, it’s about a six month migration, and, um, we were using y’all, Cercante, as a migration partner, which was extremely helpful, um, very critical to our success in that. So thanks again.

Speaker 0: And, Kelly, do you want to talk a little bit about all of your migration experience, both client side, and as a consultant?

Speaker 3: I would love to. So I’m Kelly Ryan. I’m a CRM and Marketing Automation Consultant here at Cercante. Um, I’m new to the consulting world. So in previous lives, I’ve migrated from HubSpot, Marketo, and Eloqua, all to Pardot and into each other. And then now in a consulting life, I’m talking more Marketo, um, to HubSpot to Pardot migration. So we’re moving people over in a much more streamlined way.

Speaker 0: So we clearly have a lot of experience with a lot of different today, which is great. I’m looking at our poll right now, and it seems like it’s all over the place. We have people who are considering a shift from Eloqua, HubSpot, Marketo, and then also just some basic email sending services. So I’m sure we have a lot of, um, info we can share today. Um, Zach, obviously, there’s a lot of choices out there when it comes to marketing automation. Um, so what were the key driving factors for your team to select Pardot?

Speaker 1: Sure. As a market leader, as a huge enterprise company, uh, it only really came down to Marketo or Pardot. We were already on Eloqua, uh, for the size of our organization and really what we do, HubSpot and all the other ones, they’re just so came down to that. Um, I have experience at or when I worked at Oracle, Oracle’s average averaged about four acquisitions per month. So quite often, I would be brought in as, uh, the digital marketing expert, look to see how they structured their digital marketing, and really just cherry pick the best, uh, practices that different teams had. Typically, um, because Eloqua was so robust yet very complicated, it could do everything. Right? Um, but that was our challenge at ICE Mortgage Technology is I was working too hard to maintain it all the time to make sure it was kept up to speed, and I want to have that reliance in house. So we looked, uh, and, also, Eloqua was doing an Apex update, and we were looking at pricing and all that kind of stuff. Um, when we looked into things, I have a, uh, strong opinion that if Salesforce is your CRM, that Pardot must be your MAP. It doesn’t make sense to have, uh, this all these kind of different systems for two systems that are so important to an organization. I’ll just kind of pause here because I can keep going. But does it

Speaker 0: I think that that’s great. I mean, that’s a it’s a really good takeaway. I’ve I’ve definitely heard people say that before. Um, and I we get some claps here too as well for that. Terry, I I’m wondering too if you can elaborate a little bit because, obviously, Zach moved from, you know, a pretty robust platform to another pretty robust platform. But your experience was a little different because you moved from Mailchimp to Pardot. So I was wondering what made you consider sort of leveling up from a well, basically, an email sending service to something like Pardot?

Speaker 2: Sure. Yeah. Um, thanks for the question, Christina. I would say, you know, primarily, uh, and Zach kind of touched on this as well. You know, effectively, Mailchimp just didn’t quite meet our needs as an enterprise. I think Mailchimp is much more suited to kind of that mom and pop e-commerce business or, you know, a much smaller, less experienced user base. Um, you know, managing 150 users in Mailchimp was daunting, especially given that, you know, in Mailchimp, if you can send an email, if you can press the send button, you can create a new template. You can create a new audience. You know? We had an issue where a user one time created you know, just imported an Excel list as a new audience in Mailchimp, and all of a sudden, like, our billing went up that month, and it was like, oh, what’s going on here? Um, so, you know, it’s there were definitely some some, uh, administrative challenges with Mailchimp because of that too. You know, when we transitioned, we had over a thousand templates in Mailchimp when now in Pardot, you’ve got about 70. So, you know, there were there were definitely some issues, I think, with the platform itself, uh, that granular user permissioning, definitely one of them. Um, you know, kind of this heavily e-commerce based, uh, platform didn’t really work for us as a nonprofit. You know? We’re not selling anything. Um, and then also just, um, kind of it almost encouraged you at times to, you know, kind of oh, do you want to save this as a new template? And, no. You don’t. This is not this one-off invitation does not need to be a new template. So, you know, lots of challenges. Um, and then, you know, obviously, like Zach said as well, if you’ve got Salesforce, Pardot’s the easy answer. It’s it’s they’re so intricately tied, and the solutions for integrating other platforms generally just don’t fit the bill and just aren’t going to work as well as that native Salesforce Pardot integration.

Speaker 1: A couple of quick points here is these systems are very expensive. Right? They’re from the tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands. Um, we actually found Pardot to give us a very competitive or the best pricing because of the consolidated cost with Salesforce. Marketo was the most expensive. Uh, long time ago, it was the cheapest. Um, and, really, I I must say, though, Eloqua is far more complex, but we’ve stripped away a lot of those complexities and understood that all those features and stuff that everyone wants to know what the email open rate is, but they do nothing with it. So we’re and and not that Pardot doesn’t have it, but we’ve just simplified things. I mean, Eloqua is great of if you are a multinational conglomerate and you need to have the the everything kind of in there, that’s great. Pardot will do it, but just in a simpler format.

Speaker 0: Yeah. No. I think that that’s a great call out. And, um, you know, we’re talking a lot about, um, all these big platforms. And and, Kelly, I know that you’ve touched so many of them in in your in your career trajectory. So I’m wondering what advice do you have for people or companies that are sort of looking at marketing automation platforms right now, just sort of doing like a basic evaluation or analysis of the platforms?

Speaker 3: Yeah. Definitely. It’s pretty similar what Terry and Zach said. I just like to say keep your goal in mind and keep your technology integrations in mind. So if you are trying to simplify your processes, maybe it’s more of Marketo or, I’m sorry, marketing user base versus sales. Do you need to talk to Salesforce? Like, these are going to immediately weed out a lot of these platforms, um, especially when it comes to the integration piece. Because last thing we want to do as marketing ops or reporters, um, or campaign managers is manually put everything in an Excel sheet over and over again to report on it. So just keep your goals in mind and keep what other technologies you’re using that needs to be integrated in mind.

Speaker 0: Definitely spent too much time in spreadsheets myself, so I hear that. Now, I want to shift a little bit and talk about the nitty gritty of actually doing a migration, um, because I’m sure people here are looking for advice, um, about the actual migration process. So, um, as as people who have done migrations, I’m wondering what is the best thing you did to prepare for your migration. Um, Zach, would you like to kick us off with that question?

Speaker 1: Sure. Um, I have a unique approach to migrations of any system. That’s actually one of the reasons why I got brought down to Silicon Valley for Synopsis is to bring them from Eloqua e9 to e10 to always kind of keep, uh, the marketing systems up to date. During this migration so, uh, I’ve one is we had incredible project planning, a lot of communication, um, clear understanding of what the goal was in mind, clear dates. Um, I know that a lot of times when partners are working with clients that are migrating, there’s a lot of bellyaching. There’s a lot of, oh, we don’t we we don’t have that anymore, and it just kind of slows down the project. My goal as project lead was to keep moving things forward. Yes. It won’t be the same, but don’t worry. We, Zach, how we’re going to do this? Don’t worry. We’ll figure it out. And and the reason for that is I also had buy-in from my stakeholders and my superiors where, Zach, we know it’s not going to be perfect, but get us to the point where we can start working in it and that it’s functional. And with that support, that really made things a lot easier. The thing that made things the most easiest is, um, we used Eloqua and Pardot for three months at the same time, and we were we were we we did things very gradually. Then we also used, uh, they were called BDO Digital Net or pardon me, uh, Demand Gen BDO, and we used Cercante. We used two two partners. So we we made sure that we trained, and it’s eleven months later. We still have weekly calls to make sure that we, uh, to kind of come up with these questions. To kind of think that your marketing automation platform system is going to reign gold is false. To think that one system can fit into every organization is crazy. It takes time. You need to understand how the different kind of mindset and architecture of each system is, um, and to understand that you won’t know everything and neither will your partners because of how your business is set up. But they do go in, they ask for help, and and they kind of, um, help propel the project.

Speaker 0: I mean, I’ve been working in Pardot for three or four years now. I still feel I’m learning things. Like, you just you never stop learning when you’re using a platform like Pardot. Um, there’s always something new to learn, especially with new releases. So I definitely hear that. Terry, how about you? Is there anything, you know, specific that you want to call out that really helped prepare for your migration?

Speaker 2: Yeah. For sure. I mean, I think, um, kind of similar to what Zach was saying, you know, um, certainly for us, high level stakeholder buy-in helped tremendously. Uh, we had our whole executive suite on board with this change. They knew there was a problem with Mailchimp. They knew that, you know, like Zach said, you know, it’s never going to be a perfect solution. It’s never going to be a perfect transition, but they knew that what we were going to move to was going to be better than what we had. Um, another thing we did that really, I think, was pretty critical in kind of informing our migration and and not only migration, but post migration kind of our new strategy for mailing was we we really spent basically the the entire year, most of the year of 2020, kind of doing a deep dive on our mailing data and kind of doing a big data analytics project on our data to see, you know, what lists we were using the most, what lists weren’t being used, what, um, kind of what it looked like for the average contact. You know? How many, uh, uh, we did a big, uh, data analytics dive on our event mailings because that makes up about two thirds of our total mailings, uh, and found out that, you know, we had events that people were sending six, seven invites for and, you know, just trying to increase their RSVPs. But what they don’t realize is you’re getting more opt-outs off those emails than you are new net RSVPs for your event. So, like, you’re doing damage to our list at that point. Um, so I think, you know, really kind of diving into our data before the switch and then cleaning the data up prior to migration was also really big. I mean, we went through I killed about 25,000 contacts just by running an ever bounced check, you know, and and we didn’t have any sort of, uh, uh, constant, uh, email, like data hygiene cleaner. Um, but even a one-time clean, you know, reveals a lot. And so, um, I would definitely recommend kind of fully understanding your data and what you’re trying to migrate as well as, you know, developing a strategy around that migration.

Speaker 0: Uh, I think those are really important clouds. And, Kelly, I’m I’m wondering from your perspective as somebody who’s, um, you know, worked with clients on migrations, is there anything, um, specific that you can call out for companies to prepare beyond what Terry and Zach said? Or even just, like, pitfalls that you’ve seen that you want, um, people to be aware of before the migration, like, prevent the pitfall from happening?

Speaker 3: It’s probably pretty similar, but my biggest advice is literally plan out a phase of your migration first. Don’t even touch the new technology. Don’t sign in. Plan it out. Especially when you’re moving over from larger platforms like Marketo or, um, uh, HubSpot, you want to ensure there’s going to be a lot of data that’s being so sorry. The kitten’s losing her mind. Um, there’s going to be a lot of data that is going to be lost in translation. So maybe all your HubSpot activities on your leads and contacts, they’re not going to make it over to Pardot how you expect. So ensure in your phases, pre-migration, that you’re accounting for any data gaps, any technology gaps, or historical gaps that aren’t going to make it over.

Speaker 0: So much. Um, so in terms of the migrations that that you guys have worked on, Zach, is there anything that you would have done differently during your migration if you could go back in time?

Speaker 1: I mean, hindsight is always twenty twenty, but I think we did things quite well, um, as a whole. Really, I have to give credit to my team. I’m the marketing operations manager. I just maintain things. They’re the ones who are in it every day. They’re the ones who feel the pain points between list emails and template emails. Pardot’s not perfect. I mean, uh, there’s a lot of things in terms of reporting. Zach, can you help us with this, or how do we understand that? And so my my team that that’s in or the the team I work with that’s in there every day, um, I’m quite sure they would probably answer that differently. But my job was to end Eloqua, start Pardot, make sure that we’re in there, understand what we’re what we’re going to do in there. Um, in addition, when we were kind of talking about migrating, there was a lot of not only opportunity for us to alter and improve our database, but then there was a lot of things that we had to get reviewed again by legal department. So when you’re going through your migration process, you have to think of every department, finance, you know, who’s paying for this, what are the invoices, all that. Uh, what’s h every department in your organization has to kind of be involved in or at least be aware of what’s going on, and that was another one of our successes of just making sure everyone was in lock

Speaker 0: Thank you. Um, how about you, Terry? Anything that you would out as something that you would have done differently?

Speaker 2: Yeah. For sure. Um, you know, I think, uh, like Zach said, hindsight’s really twenty twenty. But I will say one of the biggest challenges we had was concurrently running two mailing systems. Um, we ended up actually for about six weeks having both Mailchimp and Pardot stood up and sending emails, uh, which became challenging. Right? You know, our our u our subscribers are now getting these emails from two different systems. We’ve got to make sure that if they unsubscribe from one, they’re not getting it out of the other. Likewise, you know, they’re getting completely different user experiences based on now this Pardot preference center that we’re standing up versus the API connected Mailchimp one that was going directly to our website. We got all that worked out, but there was this period of about six weeks where, you know, not only am I scrambling to get my entire user base trained and migrated, but now I’m also kind of dealing with this challenge of our subscribers kind of having this disjointed experience. We even in our Pardot emails in the footer, I, like, hard coded a little note by the subscribe and manage preferences links of, like, hey. Thank you for your patience as we transition mailing systems. You know, it’s it’s a it’s a tough thing because, you know, there’s it’s it’s just not something that’s easy to do. So I would say my my kind of takeaway there was I really wish we could have shortened that time that both systems were live to maybe two weeks, um, which really, I think, ultimately, would have come down to kind of that training schedule and really ensuring that I had, uh, users trained a little quicker, um, maybe a little more efficient. You know? It was it was a bit of a challenge getting, you know, the term herding cats was definitely thrown around a few times. So but, overall, you know, I’m very happy with how it went. I’m much much happier in Pardot than I was in Mailchimp. So, um, um, nine out of 10 overall, I’d say.

Speaker 0: Well, that’s great. I know. I this the sort of transition point of keeping two systems alive at the same time is is usually very stressful for a lot of people, I found. And I really like your idea, actually, of adding a little note in the email. I’ve I’ve never seen that done before, but I I really like that idea because it kind of gives a little transparency into what’s happening to your client base.

Speaker 2: Seemed to work.

Speaker 0: Yeah. No. I think that’s awesome. Um, we have a lot of good questions coming in through the chat. And please, people, like, throw questions in there. I’m I’m going to start pulling questions from there now. Um, one that I’m hoping we can get, um, your feedback on, what are your thoughts on the latest releases of Pardot? How do you align with these, uh, releases when you’re sort of in the middle of a migration to Pardot? Um, Kelly, do you do you want to kick us off with that one?

Speaker 3: Um, so we’re happy that Pardot and Salesforce are friends and getting more attention than normal, and Pardot’s just continuing to upgrade now with Pardot Lightning and a lot of new availability features that are coming out. Um, it’s starting to be more on par to, like, HubSpot drag and drop emails. So what I like to consider is let’s migrate your basics first. Let’s just get your admin out of the way. Let’s get your templates in the weeds. Let’s make sure your audience is over, and then let’s talk about the fancy features. Let’s make sure your power users are comfortable before we add even cool stuff to just, like, completely overwhelm them sometimes. So we’re always as consultants and as now part of Salesforce users, you can subscribe to those newsletters so you’re in the loop. But just know that they’re always going to tell you what your dates for forced implementation of the new features are, and there’s always helpful guides. But there’s no reason to rush into it when you’re already dealing with a full migration.

Speaker 0: I think that’s a very, very good sound advice, um, as somebody who has been asked that question by clients before as well. Um, we also have a question here. Um, somebody would love to hear top reasons to choose Pardot over HubSpot or why you didn’t consider HubSpot as a choice. Um, Zach, did HubSpot come up for you at all when you were considering, um, a platform to switch to?

Speaker 1: In my opinion, it would be kind of Outlook, um, MailChimp. Am I back?

Speaker 0: Oh, yeah. I think you

Speaker 1: Oh, okay.

Speaker 0: You, yeah, you froze for a second.

Speaker 1: For me, I I kind of consider it there’s just Outlook, there’s MailChimp, there’s HubSpot, and then there Eloqua and Pardot. Uh, those are enterprise ones. So if you’re a large enterprise or going to be there, you need those larger ones. The the HubSpot they’re they’re really designed for the smaller SMB market.

Speaker 0: Okay. Kelly, do you have anything to add? I know you’ve worked with HubSpot in the past as well. Mhmm.

Speaker 3: I would agree with depending on what your goals and technology integrations are and who your users are going to be will determine that. So if you’re really email automation heavy, HubSpot’s really solid platform for that. But so is Pardot. So then are you more B2C me more B2B? B2C is probably more HubSpot. B2B is probably on the Pardot side. And then if you’re in Zoho or Constant Contact or Salesforce, where the connection points for those technologies? Or you’re already in HubSpot CRM, and now you just want to add the marketing part. So I would agree it’s kind of ranked both from small business B2C all the way to enterprise B2

Speaker 0: B. Okay. Um, we have a question that came in for you specifically, Zach. Um, how did you level up Pardot’s reporting capability to be similar to Eloqua’s? Is that something that you can

Speaker 1: speak to? Sure. Um, I know that this is a Pardot event, but we have to be completely transparent and intellectually honest here. Pardot’s reporting is horrible. It’s I don’t like it at all. I feel that, uh, Eloqua’s reporting was very professional, very enterprise, and I sometimes look at Pardot as being very sophomoric. I can’t get the details that I want all in one consolidated view. However, you you learn to live with it. You really do. Um, so you can do things like completion actions or tags or, um, use Salesforce reporting for it. So though it’s not how I think it should have been designed, you you will live.

Speaker 2: Just to add on to that real quick, I think someone said it earlier, you know, about, like, the open rates and that data that everybody wants and does nothing with. You know? I I wholeheartedly agree with you, Zach. Like, I I also was kind of a little, um, taken aback by Pardot reporting and was just kind of like, oh, okay. So this seems not quite the way I would have done it, like, similarly. But, again, also agree with you that the benefits you get from the rest of the platform far outweigh that little bit of reporting lacking where, again, like, most people weren’t using it to begin with. So they’re they’re not missing anything they didn’t already have. You know?

Speaker 0: Yeah. Kelly, how about you? Is there anything that you would call out specifically about reporting and options maybe with, like, Salesforce reporting, um, to get out some of the details?

Speaker 3: Definitely. Um, so in past lives, I’ve been more of a digital marketer. So having Pardot not even be connected to our digital platforms or ad platforms, there was a huge gap in data. So this is very dear to my heart. Um, I’m happy to say that Salesforce is finally stepping up and filling those gaps. So if you do have a Pardot instance with your Salesforce platform, there’s now things like campaign influence, campaign attribution models. There’s engagement history to bring all over your metrics from Pardot into Salesforce. So you truly are having that one source of truth. And then now with a couple of the releases, like, our external activities that you can connect to Pardot, um, and then there’s more API calls from Pardot that we can even connect those gaps further. We are truly making that source of truth in Salesforce now. So hopefully, that’s helping a lot of people out.

Speaker 0: Yeah. Definitely. Um, so we have a lot of questions actually about IP warming. So, you know, you you choose your platform, you decide to make the switch. Um, but, you know, Kelly, I’m thinking you specifically might have some good advice to share on this, Zach, as well. Um, Terry, like, how you went through an IP warm up process, Kelly? Like, what do you recommend for clients for IP warm up? How long should it take? When to actually do an IP warm up?

Speaker 3: Definitely. Um, so I liked what Terry was saying earlier. First, consider your data. Don’t just bring over a million contacts to boast that you have a million contacts. Bring over only 20,000 that you know for sure are one opted in to you and that actually want to hear from you. So you know as soon as you start your IP warming program that you’re not going to get blacklisted on your brand new dedicated IP. So what I always like to tell my clients is, one, consider your data first. Let’s bring over the strongest first. We could always bring people later. And then two, consider your campaign calendar. Try to find a lull in your schedule as much as possible so we can have the time to develop your emails, your email preference center, and get that list ready. And then we’re going to slowly ramp up to maybe your end of your event or your newsletter that’s getting in a refresh. So it’s going to be a slow ramp, not a fast one, especially when you have your dedicated people. Um, I’ve seen a lot of people rush it where they just bring over everyone on their newsletter and don’t phase it out from most active to least active even on the newsletter. And you start getting warnings from Pardot and your IP, uh, providers or, um, uh, evaluators, like things like, uh, SendGrid and things who are monitoring those for you. So you want to take the time to do it right because it’s really hard to fix it later.

Speaker 0: And, Kelly, the audience really wants to know, um, does the cat also agree with all of these recommendations?

Speaker 3: Yes. So this is my foster cat, Luna, and she’s in her hyper mode. So I apologize to everybody, but, yes, she’s my helper. She’s really good with the keyboard.

Speaker 1: Awesome. Couple quick pause, Aaron. Couple quick points on that. Um, Kelly’s being quite sweet and professional about this, but I’m the one who is in marketing operations and has to look at all the block bounces and everything. To give a a little context to it, so we did a IP warming to a dedicated IP, and we throttled it. So it was from October, 15,000, and we gradually built that up. The other thing to be aware of is it also monitors not only your throttling, but what your average monthly send is, which is really important. Okay? So it’s not just ramping it up because if there’s, uh, dips and valleys, it looks at that as well. We had challenges where we had people that we knew that were good in Eloqua, but when we brought them over to Pardot, they were blocked bounces. So as an, uh, marketing, um, operations manager, you’re gonna your hair will turn completely gray because you’re trying to figure out why did these people what’s going on here? It’s it so, again, when you do a migration, don’t think it’s going to rain gold and, oh, wow. We we did our IP warming. There are challenges. This is why, again, you need to have, uh, good peers or coworkers or a partner to work with because these are the challenges when you do your migration plan that don’t come up.

Speaker 0: I’m glad that I can blame my gray hair on something. Um, so we we have just about a minute left. I’m just wondering, um, Zach and Terry, one thing that has radically improved for your team with the implementation to Pardot. Uh, Zach, you first.

Speaker 1: One more time. Maybe it was just about

Speaker 0: Oh, yeah. One thing that’s radically improved for your team with the implementation of Pardot.

Speaker 1: Oh, uh, we simplify things. Um, you know what? Email marketing has changed. Open rates are not what they are anymore. I’m a firm believer on rates. If you’ve got a good database, if you’re sending the right message to the right people without annoying them, you’re they’re not unsubscribing, um, keep things simple. So that was the biggest advantage for us. We were far too complicated with, uh, trying to do everything, and then things were just constantly you’re you’re just dancing around trying to fix things. So, uh, we we’ve simplified things quite a bit.

Speaker 0: Terry, how about you?

Speaker 2: Yeah. I would say for us, uh, transparency is really the biggest thing. I mean, in our previous system, you know, we were dumping contacts into Salesforce campaigns, which we were then syncing over to Mailchimp. And once that was in Mailchimp, you had nothing but that campaign name to give you any idea of who these 40,000 people were. So, you know, someone would bring me an email from four months ago and say, hey. Do you know who these people are? And I have no idea. You know? Now in Pardot, I can see, oh, it’s these six lists. Like, these people you know? It’s just much clearer as to who is receiving our emails and why. Whereas before, we would get an angry email from someone saying, I didn’t sign up for anything close to this, and we really have no no good idea why they got that email in the first place. I can maybe go see what user created the campaign, but I can’t there’s no way for me to go see what report they use to pull them on there. So I think that for at least for me from the administrative side has been hugely helpful. Um, but, really, just all of the new you know, we moved from an email marketing tool to a marketing platform. And so for us, really kind of getting those basics down for our new users, particularly monthly as I’m kind of training new staff coming in, um, but then also kind of getting into that more advanced stuff. You know, I think Kelly just kind of mentioned that earlier. Just get the basics down, and then we’ll start chewing on the the deeper stuff. But, um, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 0: Awesome. Well, thank you so much to our panelists for for telling us your stories, sharing your experience with us, and thank you to our audience for joining us for this session. Um, we have a lot of great sessions coming up at ParDreaming, um, in just a few minutes, including one on, um, beyond unsubscribe using, um, managing unsubscribes in Salesforce and Pardot. Um, I’d be remiss if I didn’t thank our sponsors. PardDreaming would not be possible without our sponsors. Please go and visit their sponsor booths, connect with them, learn more about the products that they offer. Thank you so much for a wonderful and engaging session, and we hope to see you all at other sessions later today.